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It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (21 comments)

It's what the Internet is *for*, right?

Friday, April 25, 2008 - 12:00 AM

A reader writes...Q: I caught my boyfriend looking at Internet porn. It makes me feel like if I'm not good enough for him. How can I get him to stop?
Kiria
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, April 25, 2008 - 08:07 AM (#42398)

I hate to say but there probably is no way to make him stop. I had a similar problem with my boyfriend. Best I could do is get him to no look at those girls when I'm in the house. Yes it may make you feel like your not good enough but remember he's dating you, if he didn't find you attractive he wouldn't be.


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Sal
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, April 25, 2008 - 08:46 AM (#42400)

You need to ask yourself one thing first of all, if he's not going to stop doing it, would you rather know he was looking at them, or would you rather not.
If it's the former then you need to make sure that you don't make him feel that he needs to hide it. By all means try and talk about it with him, but don't act in a way that would make him lie about it.

There's no reason that you should feel that it makes you 'not good enough'. While women tend to me orientated toward mental stimulation to go with masturbation, men are more orientated towards visual stimulation. There probably isn't anything more in it than you making up a story/scenario in your head, it's just something he uses to turn him on.

If you still feel less important because of him looking at porn, then ask him to remind you how much you mean to him. The chances are he'd much rather spend time with you than looking at images on a computer screen, so ask him to show you that.

If it's something that you really don't want him doing then the chances are you are going to have to offer up something in return. If you don't want him looking at pornography online then give him other things that will turn him on. You could try offering him media of you, whether you let him take some photos of you, or send him some as a surprise. If you don't like that idea then try giving him things to think about, notes or emails describing what you'd like to do with him, or what you'd like him to do with you, or even a 'special night' to remember. The most important thing if you do this is to keep it fresh, if you give him something, don't expect him to just use that over and over again, give him new stuff from time to time.

Of course if there's one particular thing he looks at online then it could be that he has a particular fantasy that he is unable to act out, or to the extent he wants. In which case it's something that you'll have to talk over and decide what you want to do about it.


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markdf
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, April 25, 2008 - 09:38 AM (#42401)
In Response to Sal (#42400):

Your feelings are right -- you really aren't good enough for him. It's nothing to do with looks though. You're uptight and judgmental.

 Actually, I shouldn't be hasty. More likely it's just that you're ignorant. You've been poisoned with laughable ideas about monogamy and stuff like that.

 Welcome to reality -- men instinctively desire multiple partners. So in that sense, you definitely aren't good enough for him, for the simple reason that you are only ONE person.

 You should just be glad that your guy is subverting his instincts with pornography. He could be going to strip-clubs, hookers, or having affairs. That instinct has to come out somehow.

 It's just like how men subvert their aggressive instincts by playing sports and violent videogames instead of fighting and killing each other. Or how women subvert their maternal instincts by getting kittens and ugly miniature dogs, instead of having babies.


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Jorn
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, April 25, 2008 - 12:00 PM (#42406)

The important thing to remember is that men make a distinction between sex and masturbation. They are completely seperate activities; one is shared with a partner (or partners), and the other is a wholy individual experience. It can be tough to remember this, especially with concepts like mutual or shared masturbation, but that's an aspect of sex, not the individual action. If you force him to give up the internet stuff, he will continue to masturbate to images in his head, with the added bonus of resenting you for it.

As it is, it's not that you're not good enough. When he just wants to get himself off, he will get himself off. But when he wants sex, he goes to you.


--
Sa souvraya niende missain ye; I am lost in my own mind.
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Maeloch
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, April 25, 2008 - 12:10 PM (#42409)

There are many reasons why men look at porn. Some men use it as a substitute for multiple partners (which is a good thing, since the alternative is finding multiple partners). Some use it when their partner is unavailable. And some use it to fulfill a fantasy that they are unable (or think that they are unable) to live out in real life.

Your best bet is to talk to him about it in a constructive way. Find out why he does it, and you might figure out a way to make him want it less. You can't eliminate it, but you may be able to make it less necessary.

By the way, if you "make" him stop, that just means that he "makes" sure that you are not around.


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Kiria
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, April 25, 2008 - 03:43 PM (#42414)
In Response to markdf (#42401):

Some of us women have that mothering instinct and can't have children. I'd like you to remember that next time you want to complain about our kittens and 'ugly miniature dogs'.


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bubble181
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, April 25, 2008 - 06:15 PM (#42416)
In Response to Kiria (#42414):

I don't think he was complaining - he was citing an example. I mean, it's not like he's saying you shouldn't have kittens or miniature dogs (though he apparently doens't like chihuahuas, that's an opinion he's entitled to. I don't like dobbermanns, so what?).
After all, he's just saying it's a way to act on an instinct - I don't see him disapproving of it, quite the contrary (assuming he prefers guys playing football over guys hitting each other with swords :-p)

As to the original question: like it has bee nsaid before, men differentiate between masturbation and sex (including mutual masturbation or whatever). Masturbation's a great way to relief stress, for example.
As said before, forcing him to giev it up probably won't result in anything very positive: either he'll continue watching porn in exret, or he'll masturbate while fantasising about people he knows (which is more dangerous because those, unlike porn stars, are available), or, if he has to give up masturbation entirely, he might start fantasising about other women while he's having sex with you (which is, you know, somewhere on a list of Things You Don't Want Your Partner To Do).

See what kind of porn he likes, talk to him openly (would he like you to act the way the porn star does or not?) and try to work something out.
By the way, don't assume that because he watches, say, porn with very slutty girls, he wants you to act slutty, or because he watches porn with anal sex that he necessarily wants to have anal sex, or whatever - it's perfectly possible to watch porn about things you wouldn't want in real life - least of all from your girlfriend. Something to do with regarding different people in different lights (girlfriend = good girl, porn star = slut, good girl acting like porn star = falling off pedestal).


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markdf
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, April 25, 2008 - 08:11 PM (#42417)
In Response to Kiria (#42414):

Some of us women have that mothering instinct and can't have children. I'd like you to remember that next time you want to complain about our kittens and 'ugly miniature dogs'.

 I wasn't complaining about kittens or ugly miniature dogs (except for the ugly part). I was simply pointing out that we can't always indulge our instincts.

In fact, I actually quite like kittens -- they toilet train themselves, something that dogs (particularly ugly miniature ones), children, and certain classes of roommates don't seem inclined to do. Add in their penchant for ridding the home of spiders and low-flying insects, and they're pretty much the perfect cohabitant.

In any case, porn is no different than owning a small ugly dog -- it satisfies an instinct in a way that is practical / socially acceptable. Anyone who tries to get their partner to stop enjoying pornography deserves to be cheated on, dumped, and forced to spend the rest of their lives taking care of small ugly dogs.


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Murgatroyd
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 01:32 AM (#42418)

It's a Y chromosome thing -- you wouldn't understand.

Literally.

Number one, males generally are more visually oriented than females. OK, things that turn us on don't turn you on. So what? You're not us, and we're not you.

Number two, we enjoy being aroused, and pornography is a simple, easy, and harmless (as in "without cheating on you") way to accomplish that.

Number three, be damned glad that we do think (or at least react) the way we do -- it's what keeps us interested in you. Some of the naughty bits that you female people have are really quite unappetizing if you consider them rationally. Do you like to look at nude women? Do you ever get the urge to run your hands over their naked bodies? Unless you're a lesbian, probably not. But we do, because we've been programmed that way by three billion years of biological evolution.

On the other hand, we males generally don't read romance novels, or chase after millionaires.

How can you get him to stop? Castrate him. Literally or figuratively.


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Threesome
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 04:27 AM (#42420)

If you can't say it better than someone else - just quote him. Thus, I am referring you to Steve from Coupling (Written by Moffat):

How could you possibly enjoy a (porn) film like that?

    "Oh, because it's got naked women in it!
Look, I like naked women.
I'm a bloke. I'm supposed to like them. We're born like that.
We like naked women as soon as we're pulled out of one.
Halfway down the birth canal we're already enjoying the view.
Look, it is the four pillars of the male heterosexual psyche.
We like naked women, stockings, lesbians, and Sean Connery best as James Bond.
Because that is what being a boy is and if you don't like it, darling, join a (lesbian porn) film collective.
I want to spend the rest of my life with the woman at the end of the table.
But that does not stop me wanting to see several thousand more naked bottoms before I die.
Because that's what being a bloke is.
When man invented fire, he didn't say "Let's cook!"
He said, "Great, now we can see naked bottoms in the dark."
As soon as Caxton invented the printing press, we were using it to make pictures of, Hey--naked bottoms!
We've turned the internet into an enormous international database of naked bottoms.
So, you see, the story of male achievement through the ages, feeble though it may have been, has been the story of our struggle to get a better look at your bottoms."
/


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Murgatroyd
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 01:18 PM (#42423)
In Response to Threesome (#42420):

Tell ya what, ladies ...

We'll quit looking at pictures of naked women when you voluntarily give up soap operas,
shoes, romance novels, and chocolate.

Deal?


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Klytus
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 03:03 PM (#42426)

Think of the stereotypical controlling and jealous husband who is constantly watching his wife and limiting her contact with other men. No matter how well-behaved or faithful she is, the husband will ALWAYS feel jealous and insecure until HE does something to address those feelings. If you feel like you aren't good enough because he is looking at porn, that is an insecurity issue that YOU need to fix yourself. Because even if he does stop with the porn, there will always be other things that you can see as you not being good enough:" Why does he look at other women? Why doesn't he want to spend more time with you? Etc. I would question why you need him to stop in the first place, because Your own insecurities are not something HE can fix.

And for what its worth... I am a polyamorous man in a sexual relationship with two different women, both of whom know of each other. I date both women because they each have their own qualities which make them special - it has nothing to do with either one of them not being good enough for me. If a woman isn't good enough for me, I don't date that woman. I also look at, and masturbate to, porn on the internet. Why? Because I'm not having sex every day, but I *am* horny every day, and being male, it helps to have visuals to get my motor running.


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LisaDroesdov
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, April 26, 2008 - 07:05 PM (#42431)

Honey, porn is porn, a girlfriend is a girlfriend. You can worry when he starts taking his laptop to movies or making it breakfast after sex, or invites it on a vacation, or leaves his towels on the bathroom floor and expects the internet to clean them up. Until then, get over it.

FWIW, I am a polyamorous female, and both of my men despite LOTS of sex love their porn. Try watching it with him sometime. You might enjoy it.

-Lisa


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Murgatroyd
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Sunday, April 27, 2008 - 04:36 AM (#42435)

Welcome to reality -- men instinctively desire multiple partners. So in that sense, you definitely aren't good enough for him, for the simple reason that you are only ONE person.

You should just be glad that your guy is subverting his instincts with pornography. He could be going to strip-clubs, hookers, or having affairs. That instinct has to come out somehow.

Mark wasn't kidding. It's called the Coolidge Effect [wikipedia.org].

From Wikipedia:

In biology and psychology, the term Coolidge effect describes phenomena seen in nearly every species that it has been tested in whereby males show continuously high sexual performance given the introduction of new receptive females (e.g. Brown, 1974). The sex difference that the effect refers to is explained by Bateman's principle.

The term comes from an old joke according to which President Calvin Coolidge and his wife allegedly visited a poultry farm one day. During the tour, Mrs. Coolidge inquired of the farmer how his farm managed to produce so many fertile eggs with such a small number of roosters. The farmer proudly explained that his roosters performed their duty dozens of times each day.

"Perhaps you could point that out to Mr. Coolidge," replied the First Lady in a pointedly loud voice.

The President, overhearing the remark, asked the farmer, "Does each rooster service the same hen each time?"

"No," replied the farmer, "there are many hens for each rooster."

"Please inform Mrs. Coolidge," replied the President.

The original (Beach and Jordan, 1956) experiments with rats followed the following protocol. A male rat would be placed into an enclosed large box with four or five female rats in estrus. He would immediately begin mating with all of the female rats repeatedly until eventually exhausted. Although the females would continue nudging and licking him to continue, he would not respond. However, if a novel female were introduced to the box he would become alert and find the ability to mate once again with the new female. This phenomenon, which has been termed the Coolidge Effect, is not limited to Rattus norvegicus. It is attributed to an increase in dopamine levels and its subsequent effect upon the limbic system.

While the Coolidge effect is usually seen demonstrated by males (that is, males displaying renewed excitement with a novel female), Lester and Gorzalka came up with a model to see if the Coolidge effect occurs in females also. They used hamsters instead of rats, and the results showed that it does occur in lesser degrees in females.

Some researchers think that exposure to the pheromones of a new female is a significant factor in this phenomenon.

The Coolidge effect has sometimes been mentioned as an explanation of why pornographic images are exciting to the male when first purchased, but after repeated viewing can "lose its effect." The phenomenon may also explain why male pornographic actors may use the services of a fluffer.


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reynoldsrap
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Sunday, April 27, 2008 - 12:20 PM (#42438)

Let me chime in here. As a monogamous man in a committed relationship, I still look at porn for some of the same reasons described by other men here in this thread.

Primarily, for me, porn contains things that my girlfriend and I aren't likely to act upon any time soon if at all. It's not easy for a man to simply turn off or ignore his sexual urges, especially those that might be a bit out there or disagreeable.

Maybe your boyfriend has a fantasy that he doesn't think could or should be acted upon. If the porn he's looking at has a lot of things that you don't do, that's likely the case. I sometimes look at porn with a few men sharing a woman because I don't expect my fantasy to happen, but the porn gives me a clear visceral depiction of it, and I can let my imagination fill in the blanks (I never imagine that I'm having sex with a porn star - I like to imagine my girlfriend in her place all the time).

Or it could be that he - like 99% (only 90% admit it) of men on the earth, straight or gay - was in need of a quick, instant gratification. It may be that he's not getting enough sexual stimulation from you, so he's using porn and solo time to compensate - better than finding other flesh and blood women. (That's not saying that you should have more sex with him at all, though.)

Or perhaps he just wants some time to be alone. I'm not going to accuse you of being controlling or overjealous like some people are, but if you are in ways other than pornography, then of course he's going to need some escape. Women in porn don't get angry when a man doesn't like her dress, they aren't judgmental about a man's desires, and they don't try to change him. In that respect and that respect only, you should be like a porn star. You don't have to be a slut or be willing to do the things that the women in the movies he watches do at all, but you do have to respect that men have very distinct sexual and emotional needs, and they are different than those of a woman.

So, either learn to accept his porn habit and thank the stars that he's only using pictures and sound to satisfy his carnal cravings while working to create better mutual understanding, or accept that your perfect man is probably living in a monastery somewhere, and his profession kinda rhymes with "tunic."


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Freemage
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Tuesday, April 29, 2008 - 02:20 AM (#42455)

The key is to break this down a bit. As others noted, you are not simply going to make him stop looking at porn; most men enjoy at least occasional visual stimulation. You have a couple of choices, though, when it comes to mitigating the effects on your own self-esteem:

1: Take an interest, explore the possibilities of online erotica. There's a LOT of sex-positive, fem-friendly stuff on the web these days. If you guys have the occasional porn-date, you may not feel as disconnected from his interest in visual erotica.

2: Establish a boundary. You DO have the right to draw an ethical line. For instance, you can state right up-front that you just don't want to deal with someone who is into domination and humiliation. Just as there's sex-positive stuff out there, there's also a lot of misogynistic crap--you have the right to insist that, for instance, violence is right out.

3: If you aren't comfortable with option 1, then the 'not when I'm around' rule IS an acceptable alternative.


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CarlosCM
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, May 02, 2008 - 02:28 AM (#42521)

Before you grab the knife and go for the actual castration, try some other forms instead.

As others have said, for us men porn is just a quick fix, something like the daily quicky. So one way of stoping it without making him stop, is providing a daily quicky sex. Those who have enough sex don't usually look at porn. And you both get some pleasure out of it :)

Now, if after that he still looks for porn, then there's some underlying fantasy he wishes to fullfil. Talk to him, make him confortable in admiting whatever he may have wishes for (even if you might think it's sick. We men think the same way about women and shoes), if it doesn't make you too unconfortable ask him to show you an example.

So every couple of weeks you might want to try the fantasy with your boyfriend. This should stop him from porn.

If he is into something you don't really agree on, just tell him to watch porn when you're not around.


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markdf
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, May 02, 2008 - 09:17 AM (#42527)
In Response to CarlosCM (#42521):

Those who have enough sex don't usually look at porn. And you both get some pleasure out of it :)

Scientific research has actually shown exactly the opposite -- the more sex men have, the more they masturbate.

I know, I know, it seems as though regular sex should reduce the need to jack and/or jill oneself, but it's simply not true.

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anonymous
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Wednesday, May 14, 2008 - 01:09 AM (#42692)

You want him to stop looking at internet porn?

Good luck.

The girls in the porn movies enjoy anal sex, they enjoy deep throat oral sex, and are dressed to engage in sex. They apply make-up and dress in undergarments & outfits to provoke a sexual response. They are forward, they talk dirty, and truly love being treated like a complete slut. The girls on internet porn crave sex, which is just right for a young man's sex drive: Anytime, all the time. They do not have hang-ups about where a man 'finishes', in fact they beg for a man to finish on their faces, as well as other areas of their bodies.

They have an appetite for sex that is equivalent to a man's appetite.

It isn't about rose petals, long sessions of kissing, and love. It is about raw, carnal, hedonistic pleasure. That is why he is looking at internet porn. Those girls crave sex, and aren't passive or repressed in their expression of it.

It is his secret fantasy that you will magically transform into a nice girl in public, and a whore in his bedroom.

That is how your boyfriend wishes you would be in bed. This is not easy to read, but it is the honest truth. This is the reason he can't stop looking.

My suggestion is to try an experiment-- watch some internet porn yourself, and do to him exactly what the female does and says in the scene. See if you get a different response.


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ZenKai
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Friday, May 23, 2008 - 04:00 PM (#42866)
In Response to Kiria (#42398):

Kiria's right. Sorry kiddos, but speaking as a male (with a psychology degree), you're SOL.

I love my girl oodles, and we have a very healthy, fantastic sex-life. I don't watch porn because there's something wrong with her; far from it! I watch porn because I enjoy porn. This is seriously something on the Y-chromosome that you ladies simply need to accept. IT IS NOT A CRITICISM ON YOU!

And no, this is not something that can be resolved by, "Have you tried watching it with him?" Don't get me wrong, that's awesome too, but he'll do it with or (and?) without you. Simply understand that he IS dating you. Males can keep a distinction between lust and love, sex and emotion. Porn is gratification, nothing more.

Nihilism lacks the ironic edge you need in a postmodern moral outlook. I've shifted to Nietzschean Perspectivism, heavily alloyed with Mechanistic Determinism and Grey Goose Vodka. Noli evocare quod reprimere non potes, eh?
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Dannon
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Re: It's what the Internet is *for*, right? (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, June 14, 2008 - 07:57 AM (#43293)

I know I'm joining the discussion late, but I just wanted to put my two bits in. Most of the other posts I've seen here say "too bad", or "you'll have to trade off". Not how I see it at all.

I'm a devoted husband. Been married just over a year. And I struggle with an addiction to internet porn.

I'm not trying to give it up because my wife wants me to. She's amazing, she's even willing to watch what I like.

No, I'm trying to give it up because I am trying to grow as a person. She makes me want to be a better man, as Jack Nicholson would say. I have come to see porn as a distraction to my focus on her needs above my own. And that's what marriage is supposed to be about, right? She focuses on my needs, I focus on hers, and we both end up far more fulfilled than either of us could manage alone.

Like I said, though: It is an addiction. Just like any other, it's hard to give up. Like a fondness for too much alcohol, or a tendency to shop and rack up credit card bills to relieve stress. The only way to deal with it is personal growth. "It's natural" is a wonderful enabling justification. And it's not that human nature isn't a part of it. It's just a question of whether or not I want to be a slave to that portion of human nature.

How you can translate that into your own situation, I don't know. Good luck.


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