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POLL RESULTS: Beyond the Point of No Return: (8 comments)

POLL: Beyond the Point of No Return

Wednesday, August 12, 2009 - 12:00 AM

A reader writes...Q: I'm seventeen, male, Australian, nerdy and somewhat shy around girls. As you may have guessed, I have never had a girlfriend.

I sing in a choir. I started developing some serious feelings for one of the girls in the choir. I started hanging around with her in the hope of getting up my courage and asking her out. She didn't really seem to notice me.

A few days into the tour, the gossips in the choir said to me "We think that you two should go out. That'd be so cute!"

This affirmation removed all my fears on the matter. I made several flambouyant romantic gestures, more often than not in view of half the choir. However, she is quite shy and did not appreciate my advances; she was unsure whether I really felt for her or whether I was just playing a game. Because of this, gestures that would have been romantic in any other situation were rendered cruel.

When I eventually asked her out, she sprung the following piece of girl-code on me; "I'm sorry, but I can't see you as anything more than a friend."

Unfortunately, we haven't even been that; most of the choir has turned against me and she's been avoiding me as much as possible. Apart from my heartfelt apology when I worked out that she hadn't appreciated my advances, we haven't spoken since.

So, my question is; do I have any sort of chance with this girl, or should I just rely on the other fish in the sea?

POLL: Does he have a chance with this girl?
14% (70) Yes, faint hearts have never won fair ladies.
86% (430) No, learn from this Life Lesson and move on.
500 people have voted in this poll. (This poll is not active.)

Posts: 300

Jan 2008
Re: Beyond the Point of No Return (Score: 1)
posted Wednesday, August 12, 2009 - 01:23 AM (#48829)

Some observations:

* She's probably even less experienced than you are. You put her in a truly awkward position, one she didn't know how to deal with. You don't get a second chance to make a first impression. No matter what you do at this point, she'll react badly to it.

* Your attraction to her is almost certainly purely physical (even if it's only at the level of "she has a cute face"), because you don't know very much about her personality.

* You need to lay off the flamboyant romantic gestures and shift over to being more direct but low-key. It's too bad you didn't just say to her, "Hey, I like you and I'd like to get to know you better. Would you like to go to a movie some time?"

* Do not make a romantic gesture, flamboyant or otherwise, to a girl in front of third parties! No matter what she thinks of you, no matter what her response would be if you two were alone, you have put her into a position in which she can only be embarrassed. In addition, if she turns you down, other people may (wrongly) see her as cruel ... and she will know what they think of her and she will dislike you for it.

* I started hanging around with her in the hope of getting up my courage and asking her out. Yes, it does take courage to ask a girl to go out -- but it's better than what you did. If you just ask her, privately, the worst that can happen is that she'll turn you down. (Note: If she says no and insults you or puts you down, that's not worse -- she's done you a favor! You'll know she has a personality that disqualifies her from being girlfriend material.)

;^) And yes, I did exactly the same thing when I was your age!

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Posts: 46

Feb 2009
Re: Beyond the Point of No Return (Score: 1)
posted Wednesday, August 12, 2009 - 06:47 AM (#48832)

Well, I'm sorry to tell you but you probably screwed this one up. No reason to be sad, everybody did it at one oint or other (and most of us not only once).

I'd suggest you turn to the other fish in the sea. But it might help you if you try to understand girls first. Try to be friends with them. It is not that difficult, we're humans, too. (Kind of.)

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Posts: 49

Jun 2008
Re: Beyond the Point of No Return (Score: 1)
posted Wednesday, August 12, 2009 - 08:21 AM (#48834)

1) The Friend Zone is unrecoverable in this situation.

2) Public displays like you describe are painfully ill-advised if you don't already have an established relationship.

3) You should probably learn to read peoples reactions a little better. Understanding her dislike of the first Public Display may have prevented further displays and saved your chances to at least get to know her.

4) The guy is always wrong in these situations.

5) If you dip into the same pool for future romance, be prepared to be either refused out-of-hand because of "how you treated blah-blah" (see note 4, above) or the subject of social censure because you moved on without considering blah-blah's feelings (don't ask, it's complicated; in many ways, women are like theoretical particles except that a muon can't throw her drink in your face).

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Posts: 13

Jul 2008
Re: Beyond the Point of No Return (Score: 1)
posted Wednesday, August 12, 2009 - 09:34 AM (#48836)

also, can i just suggest that basing dating decisions on group advice (particularly a group you're labeling as "gossips") might not be the best choice? seriously, if you like someone, you LIKE someone; unless you plan to live your life based on the Court of Public Opinion's rulings, that's just setting yourself up for likely embarrassment, frustration and unhappiness.

and ditto on cooling it with the over-the-top Romantic Gestures. unless you're going for obvious parody, you're more likely to scare the girl off. extravagent public displays are usually more embarassing than impressive. or scary - guys who go overboard with displays can sometimes come off as "stalker-ish".

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Posts: 6

Aug 2009
Re: Beyond the Point of No Return (Score: 1)
posted Wednesday, August 12, 2009 - 01:14 PM (#48842)

Honestly, you're probably pretty much screwed.

First of all, you made both of you look like an ass, second, she's unwilling to accept your appologies.

However, if you are insistant on one last ditch effort, then I have only one recomendation for you.

A letter. Write her a well thought out personal letter of appology. No high flung romance, no poems, no nothing. Explain to her pretty much what you explained here, you had no clue how to approach her, and after watching entirely too many romantic movies made the wrong judgement. You can try blaming bad advice, you can try blaming bad movies, but what you really need to address is your own ineptitude.

And even the letter with something in the area of "I'm sorry I messed this up, but I hope that we can start over. If that is impossible, I accept your decision and will leave you alone."

Make sure you spell check, make sure you grammar check, and above all make sure it makes sense! You don't want to look like an even bigger idiot by screwing that up.

When you cannot handle it in person, your next best option is an actual pen and paper (or in any case computer and paper) letter. No text messages, no facebook messages. A personal thought out letter that shows you're sincere and truly care about her feelings.

If that doesn't work, I'm sure there's a hot girl in your homeroom mooning over you, or some other place ;) We find admirers everywhere, and most of the time, they're better than the people WE admire. *shrugs*

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Posts: 205

Jan 2008
Re: Beyond the Point of No Return (Score: 1)
posted Thursday, August 13, 2009 - 11:37 AM (#48854)
In Response to galaxygoddess (#48842):

Don't write her a damn thing. It demonstrates that you can't move on.

Odds are that she's feeling exactly how you feel, but for someone else. It happens. It's hard, but you'll get through it.

I'll bet that, if she saw you having a good time with a group of other girls, she'd be all up on you.

But, listen to everyone else about the gestures and overtures. It never works because everyone (girls and boys, women and men) is busy protecting their feelings and reputation.

Go somewhere and just watch people. Be sure to pay attention to boys as they try to get the attention of girls. You'll learn a lot. You may even understand why girls gravitate towards the guys that don't seem to really care one way or the other.

I'd also suggest that you should just sort of shrug this/her off and act like it never happened. Don't be a d*#k. Just treat it nonchalant, like a food fight or something. Take it as a learning experience and just be yourself and have some fun with the choir. The sooner you stop caring if she likes you or not, the sooner you can find someone who does.

Like Murg, I've been there, too. I've been on both ends of this equation.

On a separate note - Also, I can tell you that passing up on the girl that does like you just because you've got a crush on someone else can be fairly regretful, later in life. So, look around you. Maybe you've been overlooking a good thing.

Dating is about having fun, not setting up for the rest of your life.

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Posts: 12

Dec 2008
Re: Beyond the Point of No Return (Score: 1)
posted Friday, August 14, 2009 - 07:52 AM (#48869)

I have to somewhat disagree with Jes.

Do not "act like it never happened." Acting as though it just doesn't/didn't matter to you is as much a slap in her face as the semi-understandable juvenile, romantic movie idiocy that you pulled before. That type of behavior and what amounts to the "make her jealous" advice would definately ruin ANY chance you will ever have of her even asking you to put away the music at choir practice and will probably only score you points with other juvenile males who think acting "cool" means ignoring your mistakes and their consequences.

You say that you have already apologized. IF you really feel like there is anything that you need to clear up, THEN write the letter that Galaxy mentioned.

Otherwise, go on with life and choir. Don't pretend it didn't happen but don't bring it up or beat yourself up over it either. Just be yourself. Let it die naturally as these things do though it will probably take awhile to do so.

There probably is still a chance at friendship IF you give it time and space. However, as has been stated, don't get so caught up in this girl on the other side of the room that you miss the one standing beside you. She could be the new girl asking if you really did all those romantically stupid things and thinks it was a "cute". Could end up being a great conversation and friendship starter for you with someone else.

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Posts: 205

Jan 2008
Re: Beyond the Point of No Return (Score: 1)
posted Monday, August 17, 2009 - 11:03 AM (#48923)
In Response to Cat1864 (#48869):

I certainly didn't mean it as a dis, or as some sort of effort at revisionist history. Please let me clarify.

I'm not promoting denial of the occurrence. Just that he puts it behind him, and move forward as though the Earth didn't just open up inside of his chest. He has to demonstrate that he can accept rejection gracefully, or he'll never get any respect among his peers.

However, I still can't stress this enough. DO NOT WRITE ANY G_D_ LETTERS!! It's one of those ideas that only works in theory. I've both seen and experience that, although females claim to respect such things, they often can't handle them in reality. There's just too much reading into it. Also, once she's received it; there's hard-copy proof that he just can't get over her.

We all went to high school. We ALL made that mistake.

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