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POLL RESULTS: With Friends Like These...: (48 comments)
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POLL: With Friends Like These...

Friday, October 30, 2009 - 12:00 AM

A reader writes... Q: I recently went out to a bar and drank way too much. My girlfriends did not want to babysit me, so they called one of my good guy-friends to come get me. I have known him for years and trusted completely. I woke up naked in his bed the following day. When I asked him what happened, he said that I was all over him and wanted sex really bad. I have had one-night stands, but let's just say that I am not attracted to him at all. Now I don't know what to do. My girlfriends said that I could barely walk when I left. I don't see how I could have been well enough for sex. On the other hand, I feel extremely guilty for thinking such a negative thing about a friend. Should I just try to forget about this and move on?

POLL: This woman needs to...
 
2% (58) Find new girlfriends
 
1% (29) Find a new male friend
 
21% (449) Learn to drink responsibly
 
0% (15) Take a pregnancy test
 
2% (48) Get an STD screening
 
3% (79) Talk to a counsellor about date rape
 
66% (1364) All of the above
2042 people have voted in this poll. (This poll is not active.)
Khrys
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Posts: 8

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Mar 2009
Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 01:58 AM (#49873)

Sex when one party is too inebriated to legally give consent is considered rape, in most states. Even if you said you wanted it, it was obvious you were too drunk to consent. The only negating factor would be if he, also, were drunk.

I'm not saying he physically held you down and forced you to have sex, but he may have taken advantage of a situation neither of you should ever have been in.

Your best bet, at this point, is to dump all of these 'friends' and start fresh. Get checked for STDs, take a pregnancy test, get a Plan B contraceptive, talk to a counsellor about date rape... And learn to drink more responsibly.

I don't want to place blame on a victim, but you let yourself get sloppy drunk. You don't deserve the consequences, by any stretch, and if this man truly took advantage of you, he's a monster. Be more careful in the future, and don't let yourself reach the point where your friends HAVE to 'babysit' you. NO ONE likes to 'babysit' a drunk, trust me.


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CasualNotice
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 05:53 AM (#49874)

Yeah, pretty much everything that Khrys said, but with more emphasis on what a douche your male "friend" is.

You should definitely talk to a rape counsellor, and if your binge drinking is as common as you make it seem, you probably might want to talk to a therapist about your lack of reasonable limits, as well.


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NunyaBidness
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Apr 2008
Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 06:19 AM (#49875)

Legally it could be considered rape. How do you feel about it? Even though you don't remember it? And are you sure after enough booze you wouldn't?

I wouldn't necessarily blame your girlfriends. You all apparently trusted him. But...has he ever been predatory before? No one is safe around that type.

You definitely need a new male friend. Taking advantage of that situation was crass and contemptible, and he's clearly not your friend.

And definitely watch the drinking. It makes one vulnerable to all kinds of threats, including theft and mugging and forcible assault.


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Caffeine
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 07:06 AM (#49876)

Uhm... if she really was like "Oh, come on, give it to me", then he shouldn't be blamed for taking advantage of the situation. Really. It proves that he is not the best person he could have been. It proves he is male.

First of all, stupid to get that drunk. Really.

Second, what kind of friends are they if they won't look after you when you get this drunk?

Third, if the woman says "Yes", what is the man supposed to do? Get her an alcohol test and a drug screening?

(Don't hit me, I am female. I can say these things without sounding like a macho d*i*c*k.)

Now, it has happened, so what to do next?

* Get a pregnancy test and an STD screening.
* Change friends.
* Learn to drink more responsibly.

I don't know what I would do about a male friend who took advantage of a situation like this, that is all up to you. But honestly, if he is not lying, then it is not his fault.


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Turtlebuttes
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Oct 2009
Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 08:09 AM (#49877)

I agree with all the above except the comment that "its not his fault if she was asking for it."
We are all adults responsible for our own actions.
Change the list of things this lady needs to do to "to warning her friends about this man." They may not realize what has happened.
Maybe I read too much in to this letter but,this Lady also needs to begin an Alcoholics Anonymous program. Anyone who, (imho), drinks that much in a night, is in danger of harming themselves physically.
There is absolutely no excuse for what this man did. She was raped by him. I don't care what she said or did while inebriated. A child who burns themselves on a stove top (though they've been warned not to touch it), should be given help first, then admonishing. It sounds like this lady needs to figure out why she is drinking to excess.


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lckychrmsrr
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 09:12 AM (#49878)

Khrys
You don't deserve the consequences, by any stretch, and if this man truly took advantage of you, he's a monster.
CasualNotice
...more emphasis on what a douche your male "friend" is.
Caffeine has is right. Own up and be an adult. You have a choice girls. You can choose to be treated like an adult and accept the consequences of your decisions or you can choose to be treated like a child where nothing is your fault because you are too stupid and immature to know better. You CANNOT have it both

Read and understand...no man is "just friends" with a woman he does not want to sleep with. I know, I know all you cat ladies out there are already mewling away about your good guy friend. If he isn't gay, he wants to stick it to you. No exceptions.

If you're too drunk to remember ripping the clothes off your guy friend in a frenzy of horniness, and then want to call your regrettable situation rape, you have shown a complete lack of the ability to be rational and should have your right to vote, drive, own property, and go out in public without an escort revoked. After all, you just demonstrated you lack enough sense to not only stop drinking before unconsciousness but also the lack of ability to make decisions with future consequences.


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huyderman
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 11:09 AM (#49881)

I'm a little sceptical about playing the rape card here, the details are just so fuzzy. Is there any reason to believe the guy friend is lying, how long have you known him?
If the facts are as he described, and she was "horny as hell", it could be difficult to resist if he feels some attraction. I think you should talk it out with your friend. Then you can decide if it's something best moving on from, or that you should sever ties.


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CKeelty
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 12:16 PM (#49883)

Jeez, double standard much? He's responsible for his own actions, but she gets a pass for getting herself so drunk she can't make memories, and then maybe or maybe not begging him for sex?

I'm not saying it's definitely NOT rape, but how do we know? He says she was begging for sex, and she was too drunk to remember if it's true or not. It's one thing to have sex with a girl who is so drunk she's passed out, can't say no, or doesn't know what's going on, but if this girl DID beg for it, I'm sorry but that's not rape. She says she's had one-night stands in the past - and sorry for sounding unsympathetic, but someone who drink to that kind of excess is obviously trying to fill an emotional hole - which frequently manifests as a desire to fill physical holes.

The guy might honestly have been confused. I'd base my assumption on how apologetic he is - if he's saying "oh my God, I'm sorry, I thought you really wanted it" then I'd let him off the hook. If he's using "you were begging for it" to justify something, then he's a creep. Either way, you need to have a serious talk with him. BUT, your first priority is to develop more responsible drinking habits. I'm not saying you can't get drunk, but make plans ahead of time so you're not relying on the kindness of others to get you home safely. There's no reason to make yourself a victim.


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Azerik
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 12:33 PM (#49884)

Using alcohol to "remove" her ability to consent is indeed setting up a double standard. If she is unable to consent and therefore this encounter is rape, then what stops the reverse of the situation? If a guy goes out and gets seriously drunk, can he rape a girl and not be responsible since he was legally impaired?

Actions on both sides of this were reprehensible. If you are called to pick up a friend that is too intoxicated to drive, and you use that situation to have sex with that person (note neutral language, this does go both ways), then you are a lousy excuse for a friend and human being.

However, unless you have a divine ability to read a person's state of mind it would be very difficult to tell the difference between "too drunk to consent" and "inhibitions lowered voluntarily".

No matter what people want to believe, getting drunk does NOT introduce to your personality anything that wasn't already there. Alcohol just drops the filters we normally have in place to control our behavior. It only reveals and intensifies what is already there.

He should have been chivalrous enough to recognize that she wasn't in a position to make the decision.

She shouldn't have voluntarily impaired her judgment that much, or taken a cab home.


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bknabe
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 01:17 PM (#49885)
In Response to Azerik (#49884):

Azerik makes some good points. And as a guy who was single with many "platonic" girl friends for many years, I would tend to agree with whoever said guys in that situation always have a sexual interest. It may not have been a burning desire, but I often found them attractive, even if I wasn't thinking sex every time I saw them.

That said, he knew she'd been drinking, and she was supposedly so drunk she could barely walk. That says to me she was too drunk to have sex with. If there is the least chance she might not remember in the morning, she's too drunk, and he should not have taken advantage. Calling it rape may be too strong, but it was definitely the action of a schmuck and a cad. At the very least this guy would be on probation for a long time.

And if he was interested enough to take advantage, I bet her friends knew it. I'd be putting them on probation, too, because they probably had a pretty good idea of what would happen when they called him to pick her up.


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vorlonagent
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 01:53 PM (#49886)

I was on the fence about this guy until I relaized one thing.

Charged to take her home, he took her to *his* home. He chose. He took advantage and betrayed a trust. He's responsible for his actions.

Not sure if he's a predator. If he has a history of this sort of thing, well yeah.

Just because the girl is not attracted to him physically doesn't mean a thing when drunk. A whole hidden side of ourselves comes out. We talk about "beer goggles" with men. do we really assume women are somehow immune to the same thing? He's known, he's safe, he's there...If drinking to excess is normal with this girl, then sex with someone she feels safe with could very easily come to mind when she's drunk. Especially if her one-night-stands haven't been the most emotionally fulfilling things.

We all do things in a moment of weakness we regret later. That could be this guy. If the girls are out partying at some bar and this guy is actually available for the call, what does that say about him? If he's not attractive, perhaps self consciousness and lonliness too.

So say the (presumably unattached)female friend in the passenger's seat starts moaning about sex, even if she's in no position to act on it...She's known, she's safe, she wants him...That could hit a guy like a ton of bricks.

It's still wrong. He still took advantage of her trust in him even in this sympathetic scenario.

It's quite literally a screwup of the first order.

Counselling for the girl, please. But not about date-rape. Getting VERY drunk, one-night-stands...says "issues".

Morning-after pill, hells yeah.

STD screening just to be safe. Maybe the guy too, come to think of it.

New girlfriends...maybe. If they're a bunch of party-girls, then it may be hard for our girl to straighten herself out in their company. She'll get drinking and old habits could come back.

Dump the guy-friend...yeah. Betrayal is like that.


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CKeelty
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 03:12 PM (#49888)

Vorlon, if you assume the guy is telling the truth, how do you know the girl didn't start asking for sex in the car? She may have asked to go to his place instead of hers.

That's the whole problem with this situation - at least according to the letter, we don't know anything that happened because SHE doesn't know anything that happened.

Don't get me wrong, the guy's still a creep. He had a long-term friendship with this girl, and the first time they have sex is while she's totally smashed? I'd be more forgiving of that if they'd only been friends a short time, but once the boundaries of the friendship are established, the occasion when one of them is outside of her limits is not the time to expand them.

On the other hand, if she WAS asking for it, he's not obligated to say no. It's just the responsible thing to do. Once again, I've got to think that the blame for this one settles squarely on the shoulders of the girl who gets shitfaced and assumes her friends will assume responsibility for her well-being.

Also, Azerik, I have to correct you on one fact: the idea that alcohol "only reveals what's already there" is a myth. While "in vino veritas" is generally true, alcohol does CAUSE aggressive behavior, and will intensify emotions - for instance, making friendly affection into sexual attraction.


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zmortis
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 07:54 PM (#49889)

I fell into the all of the above category, but like many here I will add some more problems.

A. Drinking to the point where you lose memories, consciousness, and the ability to make sound rational decisions is never a good idea. She has a problem with alcohol. It has now even led her to a date rape scenario. She had sex without rational consent or memory. If nothing else this should be a wake up call about her behavior (the only behavior which she is in control over).

B. Hanging out with other alcoholics who are indulging themselves will never let her set herself on the right track to recovery.

C. She should report this crime to the police. That she was drunk enough to submit without a fight is never a valid excuse for a guy to have sex with someone. Any guy who will have sex with a woman who would only volunteer to have sex with them while in that condition is frankly a scumbag. (It would be different if they already were in a sexual relationship together.)

D. From the sound of her behavior the guy sounds like he needs to be checked for STDs more than she does. It sounds like from her description he is more of a lonely loser who has nothing better to do than clean up after his drunk platonic friend, so it is pretty likely the only one who got a case of the creepy crawlies is him.

E. Her so called female friends are fair weather friends at best. They are ready to hang for the good times, but not willing to stick around for the bad ones. Of course it seems likely that she is no better than her so called friends as she is willing to inflict the bad times on her friends without caring about them either.

F. A good option - find a religion. I recommend Scientology or Mormanism as they frown upon drug use and alcoholic behavior. They both offer outreach programs, and arrange marriages for their members to help them settle down.

G. The best option - take responsiblity for your life and make better choices in the future; pick better friends, act with better behavior, stay in control of yourself and your environment. While it is still possible that bad things could happen, but at least you won't be inviting them to happen through bad decisions.


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testingonetwothree
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Friday, October 30, 2009 - 10:01 PM (#49890)

'Facts' as we know them:
1. good guy-friend
2. trusted completely
3. she blacked out
4. she wakes up naked and asks what happened and he tells her

If this guy were a rapist or thought he had done this somehow against her will he would probably try to hide his actions. The mere fact that she got a straight answer about what happened leads me to believe that this is not a case of date rape.

There was a an internet lawyer, Khrys, who posted:

"Sex when one party is too inebriated to legally give consent is considered rape, in most states. Even if you said you wanted it, it was obvious you were too drunk to consent. The only negating factor would be if he, also, were drunk."

By such a standard, after every big party, many many people (boys and girls!) at my university were date raped. Several times a month. For four years. (Or more!)

Many of us haver parents or Grandparents who were sexually active during the 60's and 70's. A LOT of them were in no position to give 'legal consent' by such a definition. But consent they did! And how!

There is also this sort of assumption that if this woman did offer or ask for sex the the guy should be 'do the right thing'....which people seem to think is to say 'no'. Ummmm.....why? Saying yes isn't wrong. Going back to the whole legal 'consent' thing....if this woman was making the sexual advances.....then HE is the one who is consenting to her proposition. And apparently he was sober enough to consent according to these laws 'in most states'.

In the end the woman posts this gem:

"Should I just try to forget about this and move on?"

Umm.....you already did forget this.....time to move on.


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Murgatroyd
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 12:02 AM (#49891)

C. She should report this crime to the police. That she was drunk enough to submit without a fight is never a valid excuse for a guy to have sex with someone. Any guy who will have sex with a woman who would only volunteer to have sex with them while in that condition is frankly a scumbag. (It would be different if they already were in a sexual relationship together.)

Bullshit! She got wasted, begged him for sex, and he -- probably at least partially drunk himself -- gave in. For this he needs to go to prison and be branded a sex offender for the rest of his life? The horse you rode in on!

When I was in college, the ex-girlfriend of a friend of mine and I got drunk at a party. She came home with me and literally begged me to screw her. I didn't, at least in part because I didn't want to ruin a good friendship for something I knew wouldn't work in long term -- we were good as friends but would have been utterly incompatible as lovers. So she called me a fairy and other interesting terms trying to goad me into it ... before she eventually admitted I was right. But if I had been a bit less sober, I would have gone for it -- I liked her, she was a good person, and she had absolutely magnificent ta-tas!

F. A good option - find a religion. I recommend Scientology or Mormanism as they frown upon drug use and alcoholic behavior. They both offer outreach programs, and arrange marriages for their members to help them settle down.

What the eff? I mean, what the effing eff? Yeah, pick a religion that controls every asopect of your life, but don't bother considering whether it's actually true or not! (And face it, Scientology and Mormonism can't both be true at the same time.) Hey, how about Islam? Or the Moonies?

She doesn't need a religion, she needs a legal guardian, because she's obviously not smart enough or mature enough to be responsible for her own actions.


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DarQuing
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 02:18 AM (#49893)

I'm going to point the finger at everybody. The OP for allowing herself to get that drunk, the girlfriends for not taking responsibility, and the guy for taking advantage of the situation (even if the OP actually wanted sex).

Calling it rape seems a bit much, but I'd definitely consider dumping the friends.

I'd also seriously consider getting yourself checked for STDs and pregnancy.


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Jorn
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 04:03 AM (#49895)

Y'know, where I come from there's a concept known as personal responsibility. You got yourself drunk, and you are accountable for your own actions, even while inebriated. Even if those actions include sticking your hand down some guys pants.

If your male friend had gotten you drunk without you knowing (getting you drinks that were stronger than you knew, etc) and then taken advantage of you that would be date rape. If he was taking you home and you passed out and he then took advantage of you, that would be considered date rape. If a girl goes up to a guy and "gets all up in his biz-ness" (as I believe the kids say these days) and he accepts her advances, this is NOT rape, even if she's been drinking.

People need to remember that there's a difference between rape and sex that you regret. The former is a terrible, terrible thing that twists something wonderful into something horrific; the latter is an example of poor judgment. When people cry 'rape' in cases of poor judgment, that just makes things even worse for actual rape victims.

I also am not of the opinion that this makes the guy a scumbag; He was called to take her home, and on the way she's coming on to him, he probably thought "Awesome! We're going from friends to friends with benefits!" Were I in a similar situation and not in a committed relationship, I would likely respond the same way.

Besides, you can't find the guy TOO abhorrent, or you wouldn't be friends with him in the first place and if you were gonna fuck someone that night isn't it better that it was him than some skeeze at the bar or homeless guy in an alley?

[additional]
Just to clarify, I am in no way condoning rape or non-consensual sex, and if this guy did rape her he should be castrated and thrown down a deep hole, but the facts as presented in the question do not indicate to me that this was rape


--
Sa souvraya niende missain ye; I am lost in my own mind.
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TheOriginalJes
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Saturday, October 31, 2009 - 10:38 PM (#49903)
In Response to Murgatroyd (#49891):

Murgatroyd has the most valid counter-point, here. With a lack of reliable testimony, calling the cops would just ruin this guy's life...forever.

For a lot of guys, it's just too easy to wind up on the sex-offenders list for what really amounts to a momentary indiscretion.

Although, as it was pointed out, he did take her to his place; we still don't know enough to goad the OP into taking legal action, here.

And, like Murgatroyd, I've been in the position of passing up on such an opportunity because I felt that I needed to be the responsible on. Like him, to preserve the friendship. She did *not* thank me for it once she was sober.

As far as the rest, I'm in full agreement with the majority.


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CasualNotice
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 03:11 PM (#49906)

I would like to point out that I suggested she visit a rape counsellor, not that she call the cops. What we interpret as rape and may need counselling to get beyond, is not always the same thing as what the law defines as rape.

That being said, not being legally a rapist doesn't make the guy not a douche. I've been in that situation more than once and never took advantage of a helplessly drunk woman no matter how much she came on to me.


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MadDavid
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 03:30 PM (#49907)

In most places in the US, this is considered "Statuatory Rape," and is against the law.

To all of those people saying, "it's not his fault that he had sex with her when she was drunk and horny," bullshit. You are legally and morally required to keep your dick in your pants under those circumstances. The person capable of having control is required to have self-control. End of story.

Statuatory rape is against the law FOR A REASON. It is well known that alchohol reduces inhibitions and impairs judgment, and some men hang around in bars just to take advantage of women who get drunk.

The woman can press charges or not, depending on what she wants. But if she doesn't press charges, she should strongly aquaint the guy with what the law says, so that he won't end up in jail raping another woman.


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hammysantana
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 05:54 PM (#49908)

First of all, this is a crappy situation and agree with everyone that it is wrong.

What I don't agree is who is to blame here...First of all, your friends did take care of you by calling up a friend of yours to pick you up. Are you telling me that if everyone here went out with some friends, and one person got really drunk, everything would stop? I GUARANTEE (especially the guys here) that the person that got too drunk first would have some nasty shit done to them. So the actions by your friends sound reasonable (even better than calling a cab for you, they called someone you said you could trust).

Second of all, the next question is if you drunkly came on to your friend. I mean, yes you were drunk, but do you expect people to start carrying breathalyzers when they go out? How many people have "picked up" women/men from the bars, where one or both party's were drunk? This is not an uncommon scenario, this shit happens ALL THE FUCKING TIME PEOPLE!!! And I can also guarantee that several of the naysayers here have been in that situation!!! Let's face it, if this was someone you really liked, would you be posting it here, or would you be having some brunch with him right now?

In the end, YOU drank too much, YOU came on to your friend. As I said, the situation sucks, but you aren't blameless here...


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hammysantana
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Sunday, November 01, 2009 - 06:03 PM (#49909)
In Response to hammysantana (#49908):

Sorry...just read some of the comments and it looks like 50% or more are somewhat saying the same thing...goes I should read comments more than just the first one or two!


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Murgatroyd
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Monday, November 02, 2009 - 01:45 AM (#49915)

I would like to point out that I suggested she visit a rape counsellor, not that she call the cops.

And why do you think the rape counsellor wouldn't call the cops? There's a real chance that she could ruin his life.

Aren't you pre-judging the issue here? If you said she should see a psychologist, I'd agree. But a rape counsellor? This woman has a big problem: she drinks to the point of memory loss and sees this as normal, acceptable behavior. Waking up naked in someone else's bed and not knowing how she got there is a symptom of that problem, not the problem itself.

I've been in that situation more than once and never took advantage of a helplessly drunk woman no matter how much she came on to me.

I have too. But "helplessly drunk"? As in "too incapacitated to object to forcible rape"? Or did she simply have impaired judgment? If his story is true, she was the one who initiated the sex. Calling her "helpless" in that situation sounds to me like the "frail vessel" theory of womanhood. Yecch.

I have had one-night stands, but let's just say that I am not attracted to him at all. Now I don't know what to do.

Look, apparently it's not uncommon for this woman to go to a bar, get wasted, and have a one-night stand. The difference is that this time she regretted it the next day. I don't call that rape.

Could it be what's really upsetting her is that she doesn't want to admit to herself that she would sink so low as to want to have sex with this unattractive guy?

I don't see how I could have been well enough for sex. On the other hand, I feel extremely guilty for thinking such a negative thing about a friend.

In other words, "I hate to think that my 'good guy-friend' would rape me ... but it must have been rape, if the only alternative is that I wanted to go to bed with someone as undesirable as that!"


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Arktik
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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Monday, November 02, 2009 - 05:51 AM (#49918)

~~ Calling her "helpless" in that situation sounds to me like the "frail vessel" theory of womanhood. Yecch.~~

You forget, Murgatroyd, that we live in a society where it is taboo to show women in anything but a perfect light. Her girlfriends are now filling her head full of shit about how she owes it to herself to call the police and punish this guy who went out of his way to do a good deed.

This twit gets falling-down drunk, her girlfriends bail on her and call her "good guy friend" to clean up the mess. Let's not forget that alcohol is like KY for the brain. I cant count the number of parties and bars I have been to where women who never saw me as more than a big brother suddenly came on to me after several drinks. This didnt turn me on as much as it infuriated me.

It's called responsibility. The woman got waay to drunk and knows it. She probably came on to her "good guy-friend" during the drive to her place and he diverted to his. We have no idea what transpired during that drive and she needs to sit down and have a long heart-to-heart with him about the incident and if they can remain friends.


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Re: With Friends Like These... (Score: 1)
posted Monday, November 02, 2009 - 07:48 AM (#49919)
In Response to Murgatroyd (#49915):

And why do you think the rape counsellor wouldn't call the cops?
Because rape counsellors, like other licensed therapists, are enjoined by professional ethics and the law from divulging anything about their patients (with certain glaring exceptions). In my original post, I did also recommend she talk to someone qualified about her binge-drinking problem, but the rape (even if it was just erceived) is a completely different issue which could exacerbate the other issues she has if not dealt with.
But "helplessly drunk"? As in "too incapacitated to object to forcible rape"? Or did she simply have impaired judgment?
As in "had obviously impaired judgement, but was still lively enough to try to put her hand down my pants, nibble my ear without causing damage, or (in one case) get extremely pissed off when it became obvious I wasn't going to have sex with her (she apologized later, and thanked me). It doesn't take a neuropathologist to tell the difference between a person at normal capacity and a person whose psychological defenses and mediation are missing, but it takes a douche to ignore that information.


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